213 – Secondary Fallout, MGP Stock Drop, and Brand Perception on Bourbon Community Roundtable #35

It’s a dawn of a new day. The secondary market is scrambling to find a new home and we look at the impact this has on bourbon growth. MGP stock prices took a major hit after reports came out that aged stock hasn’t been selling and we look at new competitors in the bulk contract game. Missouri is putting itself on the map having a legally designated bourbon, but are there ulterior motives? With Knob Creek re-instating the 9 year age statement, does it make it one of the best values in bourbon? With all of these coming together, how are brands being perceived? All this on Bourbon Community Roundtable #35

Show Notes:


Have you held a bottle of bourbon in your hand and wondered how that was made? Sure there is the grains and the barrels and all the science that goes into it. But what about the packages on glass manufacturing, shipping logistics, or purchase orders for thousands of cork stoppers. These are only a handful of things you need to know. But with the University of Global’s new online distilled spirits business certificate, you’re only a few clicks away learning from industry experts. all that’s required is a bachelor’s degree. Go to business.louisville.edu slash online spirits. We got the four of us tonight so we’re going to like I said a little bit of a skeleton crew but that’s okay. Also, just the four of us know Ryan either know Ryan either he’s, he’s not feeling too We.

We had it we had a pretty good week. Hey, everyone,

it’s Episode 213

of bourbon pursuit. And this is a Community Roundtable recording. So we’ve only got just a little bit of news that we didn’t talk about in the podcast. And the first one is there was a Reddit AMA or an asking anything with Bruce and Eddie Russell. There was a lot of talk about the cornerstone rye, which is part of their newest release. But there was one question that came up on the subject of dusty that I found pretty interesting. And talked about if there’s any plans to release some older age dated bottles that have a similar makeup or construct a some of the dust sees that they’ve had before. Obviously, some of the thrill them is that they’re no longer produced. And, you know, we’ve all had a taste of probably try some mid 80s, Wild Turkey, cheesy gold foil and the likes of that. And of course, many of us would like to think that hell that it’s never going to happen. No one can replicate dusty, but here’s what Eddie said in response to that. He said that there is some stuff development that’s as close to cheesy gold foil. As we’ve gotten since that release. The taste is very similar. Well, that’s quite the cliffhanger and that’s about the juiciest detail I could find. If you want to read the entire Reddit AMA. You can get the link in our show notes. Today’s episode was recorded back on Monday, August 5, which would have been Elmer T. Lee’s 100th birthday. We talked a little bit on the show because Jordan gave us a reminder, but what we didn’t expect was to see Buffalo Trace distillery, releasing a commemorative bottle in honor of his hundredth birthday. Here’s a little information on Elmer that you may have never heard before. On August 5 1919 Elmer t Lee was born on a tobacco farm near peaks mill in Franklin County, Kentucky. Elmer served as a radar Bombardier on the 29 flights with the US Army Air Force in World War Two. After flying Michigan’s Japan through 1945 Elmer was honorably discharged in 1940 six. He then earned an engineering degree from the University of Kentucky and graduated with honors in 1949. Upon graduation, he started work at the distillery which back then was known as the George t stag distillery, where he eventually was named General Manager. He worked at the distillery and kind of marking a milestone in his career, he created the first ever single barrel bourbon that was called Blanton’s in 1984. He then retired in 1985. Elmer continued to serve as an ambassador for Buffalo Trace distillery, and the whiskey world up until his death in 2013. In honor what would have been almost 100 birthday Buffalo Trace distillery has announced they are releasing a 100 proof commemorative bottling of Elmer t leap, this 100 year tribute single barrel bourbon proceeds from the bottle of this sales will go towards the Frankfurt VFW post 4075 where else

was a former member. This is once again as you’d think a limited edition one time only release with the same age and Nashville as a standard routinely. But this whiskey is bottled at 100 proof and the suggested retail prices $100. Now, this Roundtable, it goes through a lot of topics where we start from the secondary market Fallout to deciding if bourbon brands care about their market perception. It’s it really goes in a lot of different directions and I really hope you enjoy it. But for now, you’re done listening to me. So let’s go hear from my friend Joe over a barrell bourbon, and then you’ve got Fred Minnick with above the char. I’m Joe Beatrice, founder of barrell craft spirits, we enjoy finding and identifying barrels that contain distinctive traits and characteristics. We then bottle them a cast rank to retain their authentic qualities for the whiskey enthusiast. Find out more at barrell bourbon.com.

I’m Fred Minnick, and this is above the char. This morning I made myself a big ol plate spaghetti for breakfast. That’s right. I love eating weird things for breakfast sandwiches, steaks, spaghetti, random hot dogs, and so forth. I’m not a guy who typically follows the breakfast train of thought he have to have eggs and sausage. Although if I biscuits and gravy on the menu, it’s over. I’m definitely ordering that. And I do like omelets. And you know, I like to play around. But I’m not someone who kind of follows the traditions of various meals. Sometimes I’ll want eggs at dinner for example. And the only reason why I tell you this is because I feel like people in bourbon often want permission to drink bourbon a certain way or drink bourbon in the morning, you know before you go out fishing or at lunch when you’re out with your colleagues. Bottom line is you drink bourbon how you want to and there are some rules that you should follow like I wouldn’t if you spent 1500 dollars on a bottle of bourbon. I wouldn’t mix it with coke if you paid $9 for one I would suggest like seeing if you really like it neat in you know, maybe use that as your cocktail mixing bourbon. But there really are no rules you drink bourbon how you want to. I will say that I’ve also stepped out of my comfort zone with bourbon in the last few years by making bourbon slushies. I think bourbon slushies are so wonderful and they tend to be the kind of wonderful introduction. It’s a great way to introduce bourbon to someone who does not necessarily like bourbon or want to drink it neat. So if you have a little bit of time, go check out my bourbon slushy recipe, you’ll be able to find it on bourbon plus.com here pretty soon. The irony of course is of just a few years ago, I was making fun of bourbon slushies. So let that be a warning to all of you. Be careful who you make fun of with what they drink is one day, you might find yourself pouring a little bit bourbon with a bunch of ice and lemon juice and sugar and making a slushy yourself. Also try spaghetti in the morning. It’s pretty good. And that’s this week’s above the char. Hey, if you have an idea for above the char hit me up on Twitter or Instagram. That’s at Fred Minnick again at Fred Minnick. Cheers.

Welcome back to another episode of bourbon pursuit, the official podcast of bourbon. This is the 35th recording of the bourbon Community Roundtable. This is something where we get some of the best bloggers and best writers on the scene to come and just talk about what’s happening in bourbon culture. And we are chock full with all kinds of things that have been happening in the past three weeks. This is something that we do every three weeks to kind of get caught up on really what’s happening with bourbon news. And, you know, we’re not going to talk too much about kind of what’s on the horizon. Everybody knows that. It’s fall season, Fall season means release season. So we might say that one for the next round table after this. But there’s a new face of the Round Table tonight. So I want you to Sarah to everybody. So Sarah, welcome to the show.

Thank you. Thanks. I’ve been writing a little evil spirits for about, I guess, 20 years now. So I wrote for 15 years at Leo is the barbell and then now I’m over at a inserted level until Wednesday as the culture editor, and that’s actually shutting down Wednesday. So if there’s anybody in town or outside of town that needs bourbon content, let me know.

Yeah, she’s she’s being very, very modest about it. So Sarah havens was like, she was like the bourbon beat writer for Louisville. Like anytime there was a new release a distillery opening or anything like that it by far had the biggest traction that you saw of any sort of local publication. So she did a fantastic job and all her write ups and being able to come with a very journalistic perspective as well. So thank you. Yeah, you’re giving yourself not a lot of credit, Terry, you need a little bit more. And so with that, let’s go ahead and there’s two more familiar faces in here. So you know, Blake, we’re going to have you go last because you’re you’re always

Jordan, you’re up, buddy.

Sure. This is Jordan, one of the three guys from breaking bourbon. You can find us at breaking bourbon and all the socials. Check out the website breaking bourbon, calm for your latest release calendar and reviews and articles.

Cheers. Awesome. Fall release seasons coming up. He’s going to be a busy man. Very much so but not as busy as this man with his Microsoft paint job.

Hey, we upgraded they now make a WordPress app for filling in states on a map. So

they really they do. They’ve been alive. It’s like

they made it just for you. I know in like a few years ago, I was trying to pay somebody a couple hundred bucks to do. Lo and behold, I found it for free. Even better, because you’re in paint on me. So it really, really hurts the release maps. Am I up? Oh, you’re up. Okay. I am Blake from bourbon or you can find me usually here every three to four weeks. I’m also bourbon or calm. BOURBO or burbonr.com. All the social medias as well as seal box calm. And we did get cool new seal box hats in. So yeah, I kind of testing out the new logo. And yeah, so maybe I’ll give one away by the end or something. Since we’re not allowed to do alcohol giveaways on or just we’re not on Facebook or Instagram. So

what? So again right now.

So check it out. Thanks.

And I guess that kind of leads us into the first topic tonight is kind of that was the big news. You know, it was actually it was too too roundtables. Beta been three roundtables ago, when we had Craig, one of the admins from the bourbon secondary market, which was the largest Facebook group that was out there had around 50,000 people in it, and they got really kind of the first notice that, hey, things are going to start changing. They tried to change it, they tried to say, okay, we’re not going to make this a selling form and try to change the rules. That lasted like three days. And then, about a week and a half ago, there was the the kind of basically the CNN article that went out, broke the news and said, Hey, everything that deals with cigarettes with guns with liquor, everything’s gone. And I don’t know about you all, but at least in the span of like, 72 hours, like half the groups I belong to, or just disappeared,

for sure.

Yeah. And so I guess I kind of work let’s talk about the Fallout and kind of what we’re seeing in regards of where everybody’s going moving to in sort of where everything is, gravitating towards. And since Blake, you have by far probably now one of the largest Facebook groups out there that for bourbon. Is anybody come knock on your door yet? Or is it still kind of like a? I’m still in the clear?

Yeah, no, we’ve we’ve always tried to keep away from that from bourbon or, or with the bourbon or group just because I felt like there were other groups doing it and doing it well. And I there was always that thought in the back of Hey, what if Facebook did decide to care about this stuff. And that’s what I think we’re seeing now. So we haven’t had any issues. But pretty much everyone knows, you know, it’s not for buying, selling and trading will still get the occasional post of somebody, you know, they’re doing a little fishing. But overall, we keep all that off. So I haven’t seen any issues from it. I think it’s interesting that, you know, Facebook’s deciding to crack down. Buffalo Trace seems to be pretty, pretty outspoken about it as well. You know, but it’s just whether you love it or hate it, that’s a big part of kind of the enthusiast culture is, you know, even if you weren’t buying, selling, or trading, you were still probably in those groups, just watching prices watching what goes on. So that’s a big part of the group. And I think we’ll get into that a little bit later on some of the MGP stuff. But

I know that’s, that’s actual stock markets.

Sorry, I read that wrong. But no, it is kind of a part of the culture. So it’ll be interesting to see where that goes. For me. It’s disappointing because you know, whether you had the money or not to buy, it’s still cool to see all these old rare bottles in your newsfeed. So

yeah, I think you’re right about that. I think the culture there in just the way that the secondary market have been built around, it is going to take a little bit of a hit. I mean, this is where even people that weren’t really into bourbon, they got into it and they see stuff and they become wild and actually kind of almost accelerated the bourbon culture a little bit.

It’s crazy for me why Buffalo Trace hate hates it so much. Because I mean, let’s be honest with Pappy Van Winkle really be Pappy Van Winkle if there wasn’t a lot of these guys. I mean, it’s still be very popular. But how many guys got into it? Because it’s like, oh, man, now I could turn around and sell this for profit. And then it just hyped it up even more. And now every article is like, oh, here’s the bottle that sells for 20 $300. Well, it wasn’t stores, increasing those prices, it was these Facebook groups that were increasing the market perception of it. So

I think that’s going to be interesting too, is even if people didn’t trade and they were in those groups, I think they used it to justify buying a lot more bourbon and in their entry into the hobby, quote, unquote, if you want to call it that, I mean, I know a ton of people who have massive collections, they would never sell it. But they always like saying, Oh, my collections worth 20, grand, 30 grand, right? And I’m like, Well, if you’re never going to sell it, it’s really not worth anything. Right. But I think they were able to justify that because they kept seeing all the all the bottles move on Facebook. So be interesting to see if those folks, you know, go to another platform, find different sites, or if they kind of shrug their shoulders now they go out all right on to the next thing. And I think that’s, you know, that’s going to be something that’s going to take an unexpected, but a bigger see the overall picture of what’s going on.

Sarah, where do you see kind of like how things have shifted, you know, I’ve seen groups completely changed, like, there’s no more buying, selling, there’s new, basically, they try to change the name of all the group names. Like that’s gonna do it. Like Facebook algorithms are so smart, you know, like, like Blake folded with one or


totally missed it, Adam.

Like, like, Where have you seen people start gravitating towards?

Oh, I mean, I’ve been on a lot of those groups, just because I love it reminds me of like collecting and trading baseball cards back in the day. And sometimes you can’t always get that bottle that he wants, but you have like, four other bottles that people want. So, you know, I would just kind of use it to trade and stuff. But so I mean, I’ve seen people flocking to the movie platform. But I do notice that like, it’s like probably cut in half. I mean that people might put something up there and there’s no comments whatsoever. Whereas on Facebook, you would get instant comments immediately. And it would probably be only up there if it was a good bottle for like five or 10 minutes.

Even 10 minutes is probably a stretch. I get him a bottle. Yeah, I mean, I’m on the me, we thing now too. And I had to it was just like everything else. I literally had to turn off notifications after like, an hour because like every single new post and I was like, Well, I’m never going to check this now because I go I go to Facebook for my newsfeed, right, I’ll go to the Facebook group, I’ll go whatever, I’ll kind of see what’s knew. And that was always one thing that Okay, cool. I’ll just see what kind of bottles for sale, but now I gotta go to a whole different thing to do it. So it’s, it’s going to be tough. You know, I think the I think Sarah kind of you’re right there that trying to bring a new crowd over to another platform is, it’s always gonna be an uphill battle. And so it’s gonna be interesting to kind of see what’s going to happen. And at this point, I think people started renaming the groups of things that don’t have the word

bourbon, or liquid or trading or group.

I think it’s, it’s interesting to see people’s creativity and how to try and get around it. definitely been a week or two. So we’ll see if that keeps up. But I do give folks credit, you know, a few different groups that really focus on you know, posting different items. First bourbon, I won’t mention what ones, I give them credit for their, for their creativity, that’s for sure.

I think I saw one earlier that said, like, I’ve got to brown bears for saying that.

1212 cousins name Weller,

60 fishes, it’ll be go to any of us. It’s just like, at some point, you’re like, Okay, let’s give up on this a little bit. But I mean, there’s, I mean, the other thing is, there’s there’s other platforms, there’s me, we, if you really want to do it, there’s bottle spot. There’s, there’s other places that that, you know, you can find stuff, even bottle blue book, you know, we know that people behind their like, nobody will buy your bottles from you. So there’s, there’s always going to be a market, it’s just not going to be as centralized as it once was. Oh,

yeah. And that’s what I was talking to somebody about it, and just, you know, I put this in the chat too, but just the accountability you had, because it was connected to people’s Facebook. You know, there weren’t a lot of fake accounts. So if something went wrong, you could probably track the guy down and you know, kind of the bourbon mob would be able to take care of a lot of issues that popped up. And you don’t have that on the site. Like me, we are bottle spot, which are a little more anonymous. And, you know, you lose a little bit of the trust factor when it goes off of Facebook, which is the disappointing part. Because I mean, you think of how many times how many bottles you see that went or were sold or traded on a daily basis. And how many actual horror stories you heard from people who got scammed or something. It was very small, small percentage. And that’s what I think it just opens it up for more of that when you don’t have the Facebook accountability.

Yep. And there was, there was one comment in here. I believe, I can’t scroll up and find it now. But there was somebody that said that they didn’t really know too much about bourbon until they were introduced into the secondary groups. And that kind of what introduces you to all these other bottles that are out there in the market. That was kind of my first introduction to a lot of this too, is I remember the first time that I was joining this group that I’m not gonna say any names, but when I was into it, I remember seeing like the first bottle of like, will it family state? And I’m like, Oh my god, what is this? Like? How can I get my hands on it? I mean, I went around forever going to try to find it. And I didn’t even know the entire time I just had to drive 45 minutes down the road to Barcelona go pick it up. Like it was there was always in the gift shop. So you know, there’s there’s definitely like there was an educational factor of what this brought to a bourbon consumer. But I think On the flip side, there’s also this kind of piece where it says people become a little bit immune to other everyday bottles, because all these see are unicorns and that’s all I think are really good. So there is there is a there is a downside to that as well. So, as we kind of like shift focus here, you know, one of the big things that also happened last week was in GPI anybody that is following bourbon is probably listening. This podcast is knowing that it is a huge contract distiller that’s out there, and their stock just plummet. This past week, it went from a pretty, pretty good sizable investment, if you’re into it about five or six years ago to something where you’re like, Okay, probably should think about selling at some point. But whatever it goes, I mean, we’re also kind of like in a downturn right now. It maybe if anything, now’s a good time to buy. But what happened was is Baron Baron calm, wrote an article and talked about the sales of age whiskey actually fell in the past quarter, at in GPI. And it actually sent the stock down about 26%. Back on Wednesday, July 31. And historically, in GPI has been a big game spirits outfit, like the ALGEO and they decided a long time ago to bet their popularity on building up some aged inventory. In MTP at some points, they were actually getting the the price that they wanted for it nearly three times of their actual cost. But the volumes just weren’t there as I’d hoped. And the way this article kind of summed it up was that some customers were having trouble raising the funds to make these large purchases, while others were waiting to see NGP would drop its price. Now, Blake, I’m going to hand this over to you because I know me and you we’ve seen the MGB priceless before. Do you think this as this is kind of valid, that they really were kind of trying to make it really out of out of the world here that nobody’s gonna buy it, if you have the, if you if you don’t have the wherewithal to spend that kind of cash? Well, I mean,

I have no doubt that it’s slowed down based on the price list. I mean, looking back, so we bought, it was it was 12 barrels of just under 10 years. So it’s nine years. And it was I want to say it was around $3,000 a barrel. Right now the priceless I’m seeing $3,000 a barrel probably gets you like a two year old product. From MVP, maybe, maybe four year old five year old if, if you find the right broker, that kind of stuff. So I have no doubt that people were slowing down on on their buying. And, you know, because you look at the amount of cash that it would take to do because you know, MTP only sells in really big lots, you know, you can’t buy five or 10 barrels from MVP, it’s got to be, you know, probably a half million dollar buy to buy from them. And so, you know, I just think the appetite for MVP selling probably got a little bit ahead of them and with what people were willing to spend, because then people are doing the math, it’s like, all right, how many hundred dollar bottles Can we put on the shelf, because, you know, if we’re having to buy at this price, that means our cost is x and we got a retail at at YN. So I imagine there was a slow down. And, you know, who knows? Maybe it is people trying to negotiate or? Yeah, I mean, it is interesting to see that play out on unlike a big scale of a publicly traded company, and, you know, their stock market taking that big of a hit, and one day just from that, but I’m not too shocked at all that there was a little bit of a slow down in there. But overall, I don’t think that’ll slow down the market, you know, all they have to do is reduce their costs or reduce their price, probably 10 to 15%. And it’ll probably pick right back up. And there will still make way more money than they were 510 years ago. So I don’t think it’s anything but a small bump in the road at this point.

It Sarah, I’ll ask you a question real quick. Because David Jennings of a rare bird one on one just said that in GPS now competing with some good new distillate like will it new riff? Like you kind of agree with that, that the days of you know, thinking that you can just get seven year MVP at a lower price point is is kind of done?

Yeah, I mean, I mean, we’ve got like Bardstown bourbon company coming on, I mean, I don’t know, that’s more for one level up from a consumer or you know, just one dude trying to start a business. But I think more and more competition is coming on the scene. Now, obviously, they’re not they’re distillate and it isn’t as old as MGPS. But if people are willing to wait for the price to come down a little bit, I think I think they should think about that. And like it said, the article said, I think maybe it’s talking about it, you know, it’s kind of driven people away. So maybe we should just, you know, I thought that was funny.

shouldn’t put all of our secrets out there.

Thinks what’s what’s interesting is, if you look at right MGPI stock price, I mean, this really resets, it basically resets all the gains that they made to us. 19, right, because there was a huge, they were building up pretty good in 2018. And then there’s a big dip towards the second half of 2018 going into 19, that there’s a huge run, and just looks like the markets running figure out what to do with them. Right. I think that a pretty consistent gain up through mid 18. But from here on out, I’m just like in the stock chart, it’s it’s kind of all over the place, up and down, up and down. Um, so I think the markets trying to figure out what to do with them. I think Sarah’s right, there’s a lot of new players coming online, right? I don’t think they’re going to be going anywhere, I think the markets probably trying to see what happens with overseas markets, because that really is the next big area to really put a lot of the source bourbon into. So it’s just, it’s just buying time and filling it out. But I don’t think there’s any crisis for them to really worry about per se, if anything, it’s probably a good time to buy.

Thank you. I remember looking at the price list and stuff like that maybe Blake just he’s got bigger pockets. And they gave him a better list or something like that. But I remember when I was looking at it, even the stuff that you could get your hands on, like their high right Nashville and stuff like that. It was they only had like, two to three year old age stock like that was really it. Nobody, there was nothing that said, Hey, here’s our seven to 10 years stuff like I never saw it. Now, when you want to get into higher ages, they definitely had like corn whiskey, and they had some other stuff, but not just some other regular bourbon mash bill. Blake, did you ever see some of those things of higher ages of just the bourbon stock that they had? That not within the last three years? I haven’t.

And that’s what I don’t know where it all went? Because obviously they had some

somebody had some of it.

But yeah, I haven’t seen anything over probably five years. in quite some time. And yeah, so I don’t know if they just sold out of it. Or maybe it’s the same thing. They’re just holding out for that higher price. And you know, I’m it’s getting cut a couple times before, you know makes us priceless down to me. So I’m not seeing those prices. But no, it seemed like that all evaporated about two to three years ago and most of the aged in MTP bourbon was gone. So yeah, it is interesting to to kind of see how that plays out. And somebody made another good point in the chat is, you know who they’re the distilleries and brands that are buying this. A lot of them were doing it while their own distillery gets ready. You know, somebody like a Traverse City. Let’s say new riff there. You know, there’s countless others their stuffs ready now? Yes. Smooth Ambler like, so they’re no longer relying on it. Now. That’s not to say that there’s 10 more in line right behind those guys. But you know, eventually you would think it and then you get like a Bardstown bourbon company that’s coming on. And they’re pumping out a ton of barrels right now castle and keys doing a lot of contract distilling. So so there’s a lot of other players in the game. But ultimately, just, you know, how strong is the demand side to pull all that through.

So but even with all those new players, it’s still going to take time for it to come to, you know, to come of age. So it’ll be interesting if MGPI actually has more reserved that they’re just not showing their hand on and I mean, right now everyone’s going right, if you want high age 14, you’re going after decal, right? You’re going after Tennessee whiskey. And again, there’s there’s not an unlimited supply of that either. there’s a there’s a finite amount that everyone can go after so and that dries up either, you know, MGPI has stocks to go for. Or at that point, you’re looking at trying to get Kentucky Kentucky distillery to give you some niche stock, but if not, the markets going to be if you have any barrels sitting around, it’s gonna be right for the picking. Yeah,

sir. I’ll make you kind of looking at the magic eight ball here because I start thinking about this and I see I see kind of what everything that goes around comes around sort of thing. And so when you look at what happened to the market, where mean if it just not even like go three four years ago, like nobody gave a crap about MZPI everybody used to look at it go in GPI I don’t want it and then whatever happened in the past year, six months, whatever it is, like complete one at every single bash it over it. And and now since we have all these new players coming on, yeah, you’re going to have this kind of like bulk source market that is Kentucky. It’s got that Kentucky name to it. So where do you kind of see like, if anybody’s laying down today, and we fast forward five years from now six years from now is MTP is really gonna be able to compete with all these brands are laying down stuff that now says Kentucky on it.

Right I mean, that’s a good question because it’s all about marketing. If you think about it, I mean, sure, MTP had knows how to do it makes good juice. But if you want to market your you know, bourbon a Kentucky made product Kentucky bourbon, there’s a lot behind that, you know, that MVP can’t give you so I think I know it’s gonna be interesting necessarily to watch. I think

that’s one thing to think about, you know, think about all the controversy some brands have had because they mislabeled their product because it didn’t still didn’t Indiana, you know, like the Templeton’s and others were kinda adds a little more ambiguity to some source products because of it just says distilled in Kentucky. Who knows where I came from.

That’s interesting.

Absolutely. And Jordan, we gotta give you a shout out real quick if you just like we come into like a huge batch of Elmer TV because

it would have been Helmers 100th birthday today.

Oh, is that what it is?

Okay, what a turn 100 say so little tribute little shares to Elmer

Yeah, there we go. Shout out to that. I, I saw him I saw him drinking it. He’s got like a case in his background. I was just kind of curious. What was

this Hello.

At that if I could get the phone phone call from your local and your

this is the round tables turning into the secondary market. This is now where it’s no

natural auction.

Just Just hold up a sign in front of your camera like right now.

There’s a trained auctioneer she’s going to tell you

so so as we kind of like tail off on that last comment talking about like, Where could end up being a few years versus where can talk to me for years, all this other kind of stuff that’s coming on the market. You know, there was also something that came out in whiskey advocate this past week that talks about Missouri, is now joining the ranks of Kentucky and Tennessee and actually putting in new legal rules, I guess you could say, to actually have its own silo whiskey, and in this case, bourbon. So according to House Bill 266, that was signed back on Thursday, July 11. Any whiskey labeled as Missouri bourbon must not only meet the federal standards for bourbon, but also must be mashed, fermented, distilled aged and by and the state agent oak barrels manufactured in the state. And beginning in January 1 of 2020. Made with corn exclusively grown in the state. So this law goes into effect on August 28. Now, Sarah, I’ll kind of point this one over to you a little bit. Do you see this like as a foreshadowing the effect of we could see other states coming online? I know, we kind of saw this with the Empire right thing before and stuff like that, too.

I think I mean, right now, every state actually does make a bourbon. Now, Missouri is doing their stricter laws, like kind of like we do, and Tennessee does. I think it’s only a good thing to be transparent. And especially they’re trying to keep everything within the state. And that on that note helps the agriculture part it helps the they said in the article there was they grow a lot of oak trees so that, you know, their barrels are the best they say, we can decide, agree with that. But they want to make it anything more transparent. I think it’s a good thing.

What about you, Jordan? Kind of get your thoughts on

this. Oh, this is interesting, right? I think that’s a bold move for them to do, mainly because I’m sure I’m sure you can even play. She asked the same question. Countless times a week. Well, if people reach out and say I thought bourbon can only be from Kentucky, right? So I appreciate them trying to trying to, you know, move things forward a little bit. But at the same time, I can’t imagine that’s going to help anyone by labeling up Missouri, bourbon, because people are just gonna say, Wait a second. No, no, it’s not bourbon lessons from Kentucky. Right. So it’s great. They want to be state centric. Cool. You know, but no offense, I don’t really think that’s going to really help anyone. I mean, the good. You know, the good news is local distilleries don’t need to choose to label it. Missouri bourbon. But on the flip side, I’m sure eventually there’ll be a lot of state grants tied to making Missouri bourbon just making whiskey in the state.

I mean, you could you could also see this as a as a push for tourism, right? A Missouri trail or whatever it is, like they want to do something that gives a little bit of state pride into into whatever they’re doing to

I think I mean, I think Yeah, exactly. So and I don’t think that’s a bad thing. Right. Pennsylvania, they recently just launched the the rye rebellion trail, right, the Whiskey Rebellion trail. I mean, so and that’s great for Pennsylvania and Scripps in Baltimore a little bit too, but that has a lot of history behind it, like legit history of the whole Whiskey Rebellion, everything else. So it’s a little it’s a little hard to fathom what type of history they might attach that That being said, if a distillery can come up with some crazy story about the grandfather’s recipe, and everything else, I’m sure a steak can come off the story about Wine Trail.

Yeah, so there was there was a pretty good quote here in the chat. So it came from Blake, first thing he said soon as he started talking about, he said, Oh, I Missouri resident here, I got some thoughts on this. I said, Okay, let’s hear it. He goes, the rules do nothing to actually improve the product and the barrel. So I know maybe this is this is this is also just going back to the craft versus everybody else argument. Whereas everything that is coming from the big boys like they’ve have, they’ve had time, and they’ve had stock. And not only that is you’ve got economies of scale that make it super cheap. So this could be like I said, it might have to be a long play for Missouri to get there. But you know, this is funny when when I talked to Ryan all the time, and somebody says, Oh, you gotta go check out this distillery. It’s so awesome. Like, they do this and this, and we’re like, yeah, sure, I bet you they ferment some grain of wheat, some corn, and then they probably throw it in a mash tun. And they probably just still throw in a barrel yet, like the process hasn’t changed in 20 years. Like we quit giving a shit A long time ago. And so it’s it’s kind of like, there’s there, there’s got to be something somewhere where a lot of these states can find that new. I just find find that that angle that is starting to make them.

Gotta differentiate yourself somehow

get on the map, somehow just get on the map. I don’t know what it is. But maybe this is part of it. I don’t know. I mean, Blake, you introduced me to Empire. I like you kind of see this as a move forward for a lot of people in different states.

Yeah, I mean, but you think how quickly can we burn out on it? You know, we got 50 states that we can everyone can have their own their own bourbon.

I’m waiting for the Hawaii one to come around. Because I’m going to the barrel pick. Okay.

I’m heading for that press trip if it comes up?

Yeah, I mean, it is interesting to see I think it is cool. The Missouri one, I think they’ve got a little bit with, you know, Cooper edge and everything like that the Empire I, they’ve done a really great job and making a product. There is some historical aspects best, especially with like, you know, Maryland style rise, Pennsylvania style rise. So it’s cool that they designated it brings some more attention to it, and in a little more information, because while we do get a whole lot less of the question, it’s still I mean, it popped up for me, like two weeks ago in a comment section of this post I had on seal box. And I was like, Well, you know, bourbon could only may be made in Bourbon County, Kentucky. Like, that’s just not right. Like

that. We’re past that. But a lot of

I mean, the average consumer, a lot of people still think that. Yeah, I go so far as the majority still think about it. I hope

not the majority, but you’re probably right.

You know, so it is cool. It does kind of give a little more credibility to some of these distilleries. Like Jordan said, I wish there was something that improved the product or

Yeah, thanks, Jordan. Who said that or no, Clint and Blake, there’s another there’s another Blake in there.

Likes always have the most insightful comments.

But no, I mean, I wish there was something like like a straight days designation estate would do something like that, that says, okay, it’s or bottled in bond, you know, something that that has a year state your age statement on it. That really does improve the product where it’s cool to say, Yeah, all the the grains, the oak, and everything’s from this state, but you know, could still be pretty bad, bad bourbon in those bottles. But it all in all, it’s all about marketing. So it gets the name out there more gets more people drinking bourbon. I’m for it.

I mean, I just think they they took it almost a little few steps too far. I mean, it was literally mash fermented, distilled aged bottled right, Asian oak barrels that were manufactured the state greens grown there.

Are they gonna do you know, to make it Missouri? You know, I mean,

well, like I said, I think the part that we’re probably ticket, it took it over the edge was like, had to be aged and oak barrels that were manufactured in Missouri, right. Like, there’s, we all know that like,

straight bourbon doesn’t Aqua sponsoring that bill?

Don’t talk to trees. OC that Jordan might have something that might be independent state that could have been behind that, right? Because they’ve got a huge Missouri

presence. I mean, who really benefits from that, right? So it’s going to be it’s going to be the barrel manufacturers in Missouri, the people selling trees, Missouri, it’s going to be the people growing the grains. It’s really meant to benefit the local economy.

And this is where we get into our hypothesis of things.

What moves the political?

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, but like I said, I think, you know, Jordan, you made a really good point there that, you know, it really could be ISC behind that, that really says, like, Oh, this should be a part of it. Because, you know, until I really see getting into this, I didn’t really know how many Cooper’s we even had really here in Kentucky. And so perhaps there are a few more Missouri that we are kind of not shining the light on. But it’s definitely a very valid point that you raise. Yeah, when it comes to it. So as we start moving on here, you know, Blake said something in the last segment really talking about well, if they’re going to do something like bring it make it be bottle and bond, but sort of age statement, you got to do something that really kind of Willie wants to make the consumer started gravitating towards it. And this is one thing that is sort of relatively recent that was just announced that it’s something that we’ve been all accustomed to, in the past two years now of basically every label out there losing its age statement. And this is because of the popularity of bourbon and just not being able to keep up with stocks. Nobody could forecast this to ever be where it was, however, beam Suntory came out with a press release saying that knob Creek is going UB restoring its nine year age statement on its on its bourbon. So I’ll kind of Jordan like, do you really think that all of a sudden they’re like hey, we got stocks. Do you love bourbon? How about festivals? course you do. So join bourbon pursuit in Frankfort, Kentucky on August 24. For bourbon on the banks. It’s the Commonwealth premier bourbon tasting and awards festival. You will get to taste from over 60 different bourbon spirits, wine and beer vendors plus 20 food vendors all happening with live music. Learn more about bourbon from the master distillers themselves that you’ve heard on the show and enjoy food from award winning chefs. The $65 ticket price covers everything. Don’t wait and get yours at bourbon on the banks.org. You’ve probably heard of finishing beer using whiskey barrels but Michigan distillery is doing the opposite. They’re using beer barrel

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Jordan like Do you really think that all of a sudden they’re like, Hey, we got stocks? It’s only been like a year like was this like a like a like a safe face sort of thing was this like,

is interesting. So we just did a one of our newsletters contained a topic piece on this a few weeks back. So you know you’re seeing age statements returned in a number of ways, right? So I think the knob Creek might be a little rare in the fact that it may actually return and may kind of stay the same price for the most part. But what you’re seeing as we’re noticing is age statements coming back with the price increase or age statements coming back on a limited basis. I’ll use limited loose quotes right. So the thing about a heaven Hill took off the six year right it’s coming back as a seven year as a higher price point. Right Bazell Hayden last very standard A while back all of a sudden is coming out as a 10 year limited release will see more often. right we’re seeing this 1780 more and more. And we’re seeing those age statements come back and I’m still waiting for the big one. I know this is just speculation on my part. But I’m still waiting to see Elijah Craig just the standard version come back in more premium looking Bothwell bottles in place that are more premium price point, right, because I can’t imagine that heaven hills not thinking about that. Right. But I think we’re seeing that it’s not the fact that age sucks, you know, appeared out of nowhere. It’s a business right and I’m the majority of the bourbon distilleries calculated and play this out really well. Because now people do associate age statements and bottles as being higher, higher quality, more premium, and customers are willing to pay for it. So when those demons do come back, they’re excited for right and love it or hate it. It’s the reality at least people who are bemoaning the loss of age statements have that option, but it’s going to cost a little bit more. I mean, they could have just as easily said hey, we’re going to come out with a second

product line that is nine years at an extra like $15 a bottle and just kept doing there. You know NAS seven right here whatever stuff and just kind of had two variations of knob Creek there. So I guess go ahead Jordan.

I was gonna say you kind of saw that with a heaven hill with the white label bottled in bond right? I mean, you you had my guess it wasn’t bottle and bond the one other one but you had the white label and then you had the aged white label and whatever on talk about a lot. So it’s kind of like Well, what’s the point of doing the non aged you know, the non HD version? So I think people just if there’s two options, people are always going to go for the HTML right? It’s it’s just economics on that one.

Yes, sir. I kinda want to get your your kind of take on this. I mean, because we look at the market look at what it is I mean, we had Bernie lovers on the show when right 12 lost it and you know, everybody went ape shit and then you kind of talks about like, you know, this is you know, the bourbon is a bird business not bourbon charity business. And you talked about like, well, would you rather just take it off the shelf completely? Or, you know, just bring it back to whatever it is however there you know, I don’t know what beam did to try to sit there and try to find these stocks that did this. But they did it without a price increase. So So kind of talk about your you know, kind of your feelings on this one.

You know, I think people are tiptoeing around idea of the bourbon bubble and if it’s gonna burst or what’s going to happen so i think i mean it it’s probably a way for them to be you know, more transparent it seemed it seems to be my theme but I mean, it’s a it’s kind of like a an outreach to their fans to saying hey, you know, maybe we were short on this year but now we were back you know, or it could just be like don’t leave us you know, there’s so much more on the market we you know, we value you here’s your age statement back and I don’t know that might be kind of naive thinking but I’m glad they didn’t raise the price because I like that

Yeah, well that’s what I mean I think one of the things in the press release was talking about how Fred know said when some he wants to order you know, you’re at a bar you want to order a knob Creek you expect it to be nine years now I don’t know if that’s really what is me it’s just that it could just be a blanket statement that was given in sent out of course but that was one part of it. Now one thing that was kind of coming up in the chat was people were saying that knob Creek packs knob Creek pics are the best value in bourbon. Blake I kind of want to get your your ID on that because you know most of them are 10 to 15 years old like is is it really the best value in bourbon you’re seeing right now.

Um, so knob Creek pics for me are a little hit and miss at times I’ve had some that man I’d almost put them up there with like the Booker’s 25th release or something like that and then I’ve had others it’s like wow, this is just like knob Creek off the shelf. So as far as price improve go, I can’t think of anyone else that would be better. You’re talking about essentially barrel proof 14 years old and 45 $50 a bottle whatever they are, I can’t think of one that would be better in my mind. But yeah, I mean all in all, I think the more aged options we have out there the better so that’s it’s nice to see they brought the the age statement back. I’m actually not going to talk about bakers because I just don’t want anyone messing with bakers we’re just going to stop dabbling with the design and making payroll and leave it I want the nice Devon Black Wax top sitting on the shelf every time I go in so but no I mean to the original question aside from four roses three to four years ago not Craig’s probably barrel pics that is not Greeks probably the best value there is right now. Four barrel pics that

you know it’s funny we look at we look at barrel pics we always talk about barrel pics as being one of the things that you know you don’t want to go chase after everything barrel pics is where you want to be. However it seems like this is always one of the ones that are so over saturated in the market and Jordan Did you kind of see that as one of those things that were like there’s just so many of them out there like it’s hard to just barrel fix knob Creek fix you know it’s not one of those things that people go crazy for it’s not a seven I say

that Yeah, I agree and I say that with us having a knob Creek barrel pick out there right now for folks for single girl club right 34 through a partner and it’s true people I think people have a lot more readily available knob Creek pics at their fingertips than they then they realized in them they want because most stores will have a knob Creek single barrel out there, but they’re pretty easy to get. They may not always be like a 1415 year old but they’re pretty they’re pretty well established is an easy pick for stores to do. Right and for the most part, it’s one of the ones that you just get used to knowing that Yeah, for the most part a few times here I’ll be able to go to knob Creek where I’ll pick right so the excitement factor I think isn’t there as it might be for some of the other barrel pics that people do. I’m sure you guys have seen the same thing with your barrel club pics to that you’ve done them and Blake the same thing Sarah I’m sure if you have a favorite liquor store that you go into often a little knob Creek barrel pics, they’re just one of those things that’s not sure if it’s oversaturation or so much they’re just readily available. Even if it’s just one or two, you know, a year or two or three year it’s more available than you might see some of the other brands out there that stores are doing similar things for

it, I’ll kind of toss it out to the group too. Because

I don’t think I’ve ever had a knob Creek single barrel pic that is like blown me away. But I’ve also like when we’ve done that I pre barrel pics like you go there or you get the sample shipped to you and your tastes of them. There’s not a huge very difference between them like they just seem like they seem very they’re all the same as me. I mean, I haven’t really found like some that are just like crazy off profile like you have some that are like with Buffalo Trace that are just like you never would expect to this be Buffalo Trace versus some that are very sweet. And you can say that about a lot of different brands out there even new riff being one where you get a bunch of different flavors out of these barrels and stuff like that. I’ll kind of toss it out to you all like have you seen like a lot of variants in your in your knob Creek single barrel pics.

So to me, the beam, kind of that funky beam, pod wet cardboard note always shines through.

Nothing that’s a cell point like that, that Yeah,

no. Bad. That’s why I lead with peanuts.

But I have had a few that I’m like, wow, this is really good. So you know, I wouldn’t say they’re all the same.

But you know you think about other Well, I guess pretty much everyone is using the same Nashville same everything. So beam definitely has a lot more to choose from. So if they’re going for a profile, they’ve got plenty of barrels to pick from to find to put into the single barrel program that are all pretty similar. So but you know, I’ll defend them a little bit there and say I’ve had some that are definitely better than others and some I thought were standouts, but I think if you put really anything beam in a lineup and you knows down the line, you’re going to pick that pick that out immediately. So I think that plays a role as well.

Does anybody else get a little like turned off? Sometimes when they only roll out three barrels for you to

try travesty? It’s a

Yeah. You’re like, come on, I’m better at this like that. That’s where you bring your own drill and just start walking.

Because they love that. Yeah, you if you want to get arrested and never invited back again, that’s that’s the recipe.

Alright, so let’s go ahead, we’ll kind of shift it to maybe one of the last topics for tonight as we start winding this down. But it’s, it really plays into really well of that last topic, because, you know, Jim Beam is has done a very, very good job at looking at the market looking at its consumers, and saying, like, hey, let’s restore this age statement, we’re not gonna raise the price, we’re not gonna do anything like that. You know, and there’s other brands out there that are handling this in the same exact way. So let’s talk about the impact of what brand perception really is. So you’ve got Buffalo Trace, you know, they stated that they will never raise their prices. You’ve got heaven Hill who did the exact opposite and raise their prices? I’m kind of curious on on. In Sir, I’ll kind of let you kind of go first here like, what do you think is the the brand perception people will have when you have, like, that was an example like that, where somebody is raising prices? somebody saying I’m going to keep them steady? I feel like we’re running get into like political debates, like, yeah, like, I’m gonna raise taxes like no, you know, it’s, it’s kind of like that. So kind of kind of talk about, like, how do you see brands in a certain light when they when they do this sort of thing?

I’m, I think, at the end of the day, people like what they like, and they’re loyal.

I think I mean, the heaven Hill thing, you know, taking it off the market, and then raising it a year. And putting, you know, raising the price on it. That was a little like, you know, like, come on, you know, I’m brand loyal to you. But at the end of the day, like you guys were saying it’s a it’s a business. And if people are willing to pay it, then then why not? But I think I still think at the end of day you have your favorite and that’s what you’re going to go to, if you can find it.

And I have to kind of correct myself a little bit because makki sick in the chat said, well, BT just raised the prices on OWA. And I was like, Okay, okay, they did do that. Some other kind of lower end brands. Yes. They’re I shouldn’t say lower end but they’re some are more everyday consumer brands. Yes. However, sir, more their premium items. Pretty much thing level field, there there be tax in the package in the world, they’re really kind of stay in there for at least as least as far as we know. We’ll see when the press release comes out in this fall.

Yeah, I’d be shocked if they raise those prices more than it’ll be up. $10 it’ll be what are we at now? They’re like,

9999 Yeah,

yeah, it’ll be up. $10. And, you know, I, it is a It’s funny how short our memory is on all this stuff. Because, you know, I feel like we pick on heaven Hill a little bit because they’ve seemed to have done the most with, you know, Elijah Craig 18. Going away, coming back at $110. More, you know, no, we’re not dropping the age statement of Elijah Craig. Oh, there goes the age statement. So we’re going to pick on somebody else. So like, Buffalo Trace, they raise OWA prices, higher than well, or 12. There’s all this you know, if you look at what the what’s going on behind the scenes with a lot of the what these stores have to do to get, you know, Sazerac and Buffalo Trace products in that’s to me is almost even worse than some of the other people but everyone has a short memory. Am I going to not buy a bottle of George t stag tomorrow? Because my retailer went in debt buying, you know, weekly vodka so he could get that one bottle? No, I’m gonna buy that bottle. So, you know, it’s the whole consumer. Not to say that a lot of these distillers are bulletproof. But there’s so many new people coming in, who just don’t care or will never know, like, the details of stuff that goes on. I think, you know, the brands and distillers feel that a little bit and they just keep moving forward, they increase profits, they increase expansion, whatever it is. I just want to drink good bourbon. And you know, I can’t think of one distillery that’s done anything that’s like a you know, I will never drink them again because of it. I mean, shoot, I tried Templeton a few months back after swore them off because of all their flavoring and no, we don’t flavor and all this stuff. And I was like, as not as bad as I, you know, I was thinking it was terrible, but it’s not that bad. So um, yeah, I mean, I think there’s just a lot of room for for distilleries to move right now, especially with so many new people coming in.

I think it’s a it’s on the flip side, it’s a fine line, right. So I appreciate what Buffalo Trace is doing by artificially keeping prices low on some of their products, because you have to remember the world we plan, right? We drink a lot of their spirits. But we’ll go back to bourbon most often. But the average consumer you’re competing not just for for what they buy in the shelves in the bourbon section. But if you piss them off enough, and they start going to discover other spirits, right? Take a bourbon iOS, and he’s really into rum. Or he’s really into Armagnac, or he’s really into mezcal or anything else. Right? They may not return to the bourbon section anymore. And yeah, you may have actually pissed off that person enough that once they found another spirit at a valuable price, they might just be done with bourbon. So it’s that fine line that you have to play of capturing the consumers are entering into the to the bourbon world and are willing to spend money, but also those longtime drinkers who are willing and able to switch spirit categories and don’t have the discretionary income to just buy everything everywhere.

I’ll buy everything everywhere.

Wow. I mean, we might buy everything everywhere. But you know what I mean?

Is if travel takes the right place, you see the right bottle? Yeah, well, of course. Oh, for sure.

Yeah, go ahead, like whole new market. Because there there was the guys who were just completely rien loyal, where they needed bourbon, they walked in and grabbed a bottle of Maker’s Mark, and there was nothing else. And now I think it’s a little more people are exploring. So I think brand loyalty that’s being built and, you know, kind of the goodwill will mean a lot in the coming years.

I think everybody brings a very valid point to this, because when you look at how brands are handling this, they’re all doing it different ways. And I think the one thing that people are the brands have to understand is that this is a long game. If you’re if you’re trying to go out for the short game, you’re only going to succeed in the short game. And if you are trying to make a lasting impression that’s going to last for decades, you know, making sure that you know, trying to raise prices trying to do this. Who knows it could backfire. You know, we’ve talked about on the roundtable before, and I think Blake brought it up that we could just be now experiencing the very beginning of what could be a super super super premium market where there will be a need to have $1,000 bottles of bourbon, like regularly on the shelves. As as we try to compete with scotch and stuff like that. So seeing is how it I don’t know. And I look at it from two different angles now that I’m kind of saying and I’m kind of flip flopping on myself. It’s kind of like yeah, maybe they should be raising prices. And then the other side of me saying like those bastards, why they’re raising prices. But I mean, that’s that’s that’s sort of like the, you know, we’re in a very transformative time, I think for bourbon, where we see this massive growth, this massive opportunity. And it’s either like, what kind of game you’re going to play and in where can you either increase profits a little bit that makes makes you have a little more longevity? versus Where are you just basically taking advantage of the market and saying, I’ve got a 12 year old NGP bottle, and I’m selling it for $250 a bottle. Yeah. Right. Like that’s, that’s short term thinking. And so we’ll kind of see exactly what how that sort of plays out in the the upcoming upcoming pieces here. But, you know, I think that’s going to kind of round out a lot of the questions that we had for the night really looking at exactly the market where it is. I mean, we covered we covered a lot tonight.

knockout topics from there’s only four people here.

Say I was like we were bam, bam, bam, bam

GP stock prices, Missouri bourbon knob Creek. I mean,

so it was it was awesome to have everybody on here and even huge thanks to everybody that joined in the chat. I know some people were sitting there saying that, you know, you know, Blake it talks about like, yeah, buy a bunch of boxes, so I can buy that and everybody’s like, Hey,

I love I love Wheatley vodka. Like anybody’s like this is a safe space. Fred’s not here. We could talk about vodka.

We can mention it now that

don’t save just remember that.

Absolutely. So as we sort of start closing this out, want to give everybody a chance to say, you know, kind of where they’re where they’re from, where they blog, everything like that. So Jordan, I’ll let you go first.

Yeah, this is Jordan from breaking bourbon calm and the three guys who runs the site, you can find us and all the socials and patreon at breaking bourbon. A visit the site for updated Release Calendar that goes out almost daily basis and your latest reviews and articles. Awesome, Sarah.

Um, yeah, so I have my blog, still my barbell blog, which is www dot barbell blog. com, and I suppose I’ll be ramping that up a little bit. until I’ve find some outlets to write in. And also I’m doing tuck tuck tours around downtown Louisville for bourbon city cruisers. So you can go online at urban city cruisers calm and I can take you on a cocktail tour or a distillery tour. Or

you gotta request sir, though,

yeah. Yeah,

tipper well, tipper white Yeah.

Blake, go ahead.

Alright, I’m Blake from burner bourbbonr.com a

fan. We talked about earlier that that extra hours gonna throw up all the got me like,

how the spelling is thrown me off tonight. I don’t know why. But anyways, yeah, find me on all the social media has joined the bourbon or email list to get an email every Friday with all the bourbon roundup from what went on that week, and in articles, reviews, all that kind of stuff. You can also find me at CEO box calm. That’s it. ELBACHS for any crass spirit needs you have, once again, it’s been fun. So thanks for having me on. Absolutely. You know, this is usually when I turn it over to Ryan and have him close it out. Because I always put him on the spot like that. I’m like, Hey, I’ll do my thing. And then like Ryan, go ahead and do it. And he’s like, okay, sorry. Yeah, I’ll go

do that. But I’ll go ahead and do that. You know, once again, everybody, thank you for coming on is it was a fun discussion, I thought we talked about a lot of good bourbon culture topics that are kind of really top of mind some some news and stuff like that really didn’t really dive into our eight balls tonight and try to figure out a lot of like, future, you know, picture thinking and stuff like that. But, you know, we’ve got we got a lot of stuff coming up here with the fall release season. And looking forward to a few more of these here. As we start closing out the end of the year. I think we only have like, Oh gosh, like three or four by four, maybe four or five left. So thinking about it. Yeah. 2019 is coming to a close. So how about it? How about it? So once again, thank you all for coming on. If make sure you follow bourbon pursuit Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, if you like what you hear, support the show be like the people that are helping us make the show bigger and better every single day. patreon.com slash bourbon pursuit. And if you have those show suggestions, things you want to hear other bloggers you’d rather see on here because these guys are, you know, Jordan and Blake they’re if they’re all way too often. So if we want to kick them off

somebody else’s shot you just let me know

the island.

Yeah, never. We gotta we gotta have our regulars on here. So. So send us an email team at bourbon pursuit.com. And with that, we’ll see everybody like at bourbon or calm just

so I can see.


yeah, I’ll screenshot everything.

But thanks, everybody, and we’ll see you all next week.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

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